Tuesday, May 09, 2006

More Global Warming...

Global Warming-




Seems the guys over at Nasa have been using the Global Surveyor to take some photos and have found that the southern polar Ice Cap has been melting at an increased rate. It is predicted that the ice cap may evaporate within a few thousand years... on Mars...

http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn1660 ...

(Paste the above line with out the last 3 dots... When I put link here it changes to a survey and not the article)

It appears that Mars is going thru a multi-year climate cycle and this has been going on for sometime in the past & many different times. As hard as they tried the scientist over at NASA used the Global Surveyor and it's powerful cameras to look for evidence of SUV's on the martian surface but found none to explain the increased temperatures. There are also reports that it is possible that the Sun is also going thru a period where it is now hotter then it has been in the past and this to is also "Normal" and has happened in the past...

Hey, don't we share the same Sun?...

19 comments:

Bubba said...

Maybe the cloaking devices that the Big Evil Oil Companies (on Mars) installed on everything use fossil fuels instead of "clean" power. OR.... it is obvious that the holes our probes punched thru the ozone layer there allowed more solar radiation to melt the caps. OR..... the impact of the mars rover altered the orbit and brought the planet closer to the sun.

WOW thinking like an Enviro-Nazi gives me a headache!

RightsideVA said...

I thought it might be because of all the oil that the evil Haliburton was hiding on the planet to keep it off the market and drive prices up higher. Perfect place to put it for nobody would find it there, look, we hid all that oil in a vast wasteland like ANWR & the greedy Republicans found it there...

It is unfortunate that the litlle greem Martian dudes found the oil and became fat, drunk, and stupid with the oil...

Bubba said...

Yup. We have all seen the large facility that Marvin the Martian has on Mars. The industrial base required to produce the cannon that fires the X32 Space Modulator had to have created the current conditions there. Dang Alien WMD's. Most Likely a misfire made the whole planet Red!

zen said...

Are you suggesting that human activity has no bearing on the rise of global temperatures here on Earth? That the impact of industrialization, destruction of wetlands and rainforests, growing numbers of millions of automobiles pumping out pollution, burning of fossil fuels, etc...have no negative effects on the environment?
Cosmic cycles and patterns no doubt have influence over our planet, but it is extremely negligent to ignore the damage human activity plays in the equation.
Granted this is not what your post says. Just wondering if you've something more that you're eluding to.
Scientific consensus strongly agrees that we must begin to treat this as a serious problem.

zen said...

Aye but before I could post my comment I see that, once again, rather than have a meaningful discussion some would rather resort to juvenile, partsain critcizm. Nice bubble you've built here.

Bubba said...

I agree that there are things we should be doing to develop cleaner fuels and use clean energy. But it seems that people on both sides of the fence are reluctant. I don't see the problem to be "Big Oil" anymore because they can transition well into "Big Solar" or "Big 'Clean Stuff'" I see the problem as backlash from NIMBY groups and enviromental groups stoping construction and development.

RightsideVA said...

Zen !!!

Where you been?
Good to have you back to keep us Radical-Rascal Republicans in line and away from martian conspiracy theories...

Human industry has effects on the environment and I believe we need to address the issues the best we can. But it must be done in a way that is the correct balance between the two "extremes". Sure we need to clean up the air the best we can but not at a cost of eliminating all fossil fuel use. Data shows that the air quality has improved over the decades but that is no reason to pollute because we can...

Have to admit that I liked the idea of starting a thread on the energy\environment issue but have been spending the last couple of days researching the true meaning of "Snarky" comments and the proper use of them...

This could be a very good topic for there is a lot of info & opinions between our "Panel" here. Just need to keep Bubba from straying towards the "Martian conspiracy Chronicals" and on topic...

Let the games begin....

Bubba said...

Zen,

What is wrong with a little comedy channel like satire? Just trying to get the young people interested.

zen said...

lol...I dig it Bubba, I guess your routine just leaves a lot to be desired.

The key is to get the market involved in creating eco-friendly technologies and products. There is without a doubt a burgeoning boom coming for the industries and companies that can fill this need. And lots of money to be made—which as we know, is what will help realize this path to better stewardship of our enviornment.
What also must happen is to quit diminishing 'green' attitudes as a subject for ridicule. "Enviro-Nazi" or "tree-hugger" will not help market clean-fuel technologies or eco-compatable lifestyles.

Bubba said...

Oh I agree. But the Enviro-Nazi's gon't have green attitudes, they have retro attitudes. They don't propose new tech or anything. They exist soley to stop development of anything that doesn't grow from a seed. They are kind of like modern political Amish people who reject any forward progress. If it was not for the Enviro-Nazi contengent many of the old grand-fathered power plants would have been upgraded and produce less tonnage of particulate emissions but since the old plants would have to be brought to current statutes instead of just improved they leave them belching pollution.

I love "green" people but I have no use for Enviro-Nazi's. ......... well.. except for the tree hugger that cut down my tree stand...but that is one body they will never find.....LOL

zen said...

Here's a good start on drawing attention to a substantive manner to what is happening so we can begin to discuss how to fix it.

RightsideVA said...

Zen,

Good link but I must tell you that when it comes to Al Gore I question his "Motives" at times...

I will probably see the film at a later time but I fear I may put it in the same category as "Fahrenheit 9/11" which I own and still have not been able to view completely due to the bias, attacks, tactics, and out right falsehoods in the statements...

I do notice that they mention that Gore talks about his "disapointment in the Supreme Court decision", his family history with tobacco, and images of Gore sitting in a classroom lecture... What does this have to do with the film and\or topic?

I believe that the temperature is rising and is something we need to look at but I question the motives and accuracy of statements made by Scientists and "Those who Know"...
Can't prove it but I think many of these same people are the ones claiming who back in the 1970's that we were headed for an ice age and it was the theme for the first "Earth Day"...

Data shows that the air quality has improved over the decades but yet this is what is blamed for Global Warming. Data shows that China and much of Asia are the main producers of pollution but yet we need to give them a free pass for it is only the United States that is at fault?

I am in favor of cleaning the air even more and increasing technology to get away from burning fossil fuels just from a different viewpoint. I am sure you will question my motives in this area, just as I question Al Gore motives for mentioning the "Supreme Court Decision" in his scientific\Environmental movie....

zen said...

I think the film puts Gore, and his slideshow, in context. He has been giving versions of this slideshow since he was in Congress in the early 70's. I think the filmakers see Gore's story as one of persevering in what he believes in—a constant in a life that has transitioned from farmlife, to Congress, to White House, to private sector—yet he remains commited to his beliefs. That would be his motive—principles. It makes for a more interesting story and illustrates that generating political will to act shouldn't be hindered by adversity or setbacks.
Now is there another motive behind the film? Maybe, but from all reviews that I've seen, this movie is focused on the issue of climate change. If Gore's awareness and leadership in this arena bring about favorable attention, then perhas it is well-deserved. In short I think it would be wrong to write-off this film purely out of speculation and suspicion.

If this film, or Gore particularly, wanted to make an issue of the Bush administration's negligence/ignorance of science, it would be easy to illustrate. But we need to transcend that bickering and focus on solutions in this area. In turn that negligence will become apparent, and is not limited to any one political party.

Why is there such a backlash against science and intelligence in this country?
Do you think that science is 'set in stone', or that it becomes more complete as more data is collected? As we learn more, we know more. Years ago physicians didn't see smoking as harmful, now we know better. Does that invalidate medical science? Of course not.

Bubba said...

I agree that a lot of the current trend to global warming has to be related to India and China. I will try to find a article I read a while back about the technology that is being used in many of the developing countries to generate power. I most cases is was boiler tech about equal to what we had in the 50's without even the most basic scrubbers to get the pollution out. With the huge demand for power that cannot be a good thing. Couple that with the global reduction in air scrubbing rainforests and you are gonna get elevated CO2 levels and warming effects, not to mention the enviromental degradation from the acid rain produced from all the pollutants from thse plants. That is why I was so glad to see Bush giving India the nuclear tech we are gonna help them with. Research into alternate energy sources is the only way to alter the path we are on, as far as I see it. Then one has to ask if these developing countries will have the economy or desire to refit for the sake of the enviroment.?

Of course the more research we get the more refined the science becomes, but if people keep blocking attempts to create the facilities that will generate the research we will continue to spin our wheels and get no where.

There is a definite backlash against science and intelligence in the USA and it is created by the Department of Education and the teacher's union coupled with the govm't school system. People lash out at what they cannot understand and our schools are not giving the masses the ability to understand basic finance and economy much less the global situation over energy and pollution.

I would like to see Gore's slide show. If he has been giving it for that long it should be great and the movie might actually be worth watching if the reviews are good, but will the movie stand a chance against American Idol reruns or a new action movie? I think not. Unfortunately as a people the masses have become complacent and docile only reacting to what is fed to them. The current menu seems only to have Bush and War entree's with Mid-term projections for dessert. We need to start spoon feeding the masses enviromental issues too.

zen said...

Read this

Bubba said...

Interesting Biography......

they do have a point though that no matter what he does he will be tarnished by the election and the political fallout.

RightsideVA said...

This timer appears on www.junkscience.com

"Since February 16, 2005, the Kyoto Protocol has cost US$ 184,868,642,903 while potentially saving an undetectable 0.001917156 °C by the year 2050."

Interesting webpage and alot of info about many different topics. The Kyoto Protocol was voted against ALL of the Senators when Clinton\Gore pushed it. I agree we must do something but look at the estimated Temp change of 0.001917156 °C by the year 2050.

We should not ignore any problem or do nothing, but has there been any estimates that we could change the temperature any more then .0019?

Bubba said...

Here is more on Gore......
http://www.dailycamera.com/bdc/county_news/article/0,1713,BDC_2423_4697798,00.html

He is wish-washy on if he will run or not. In the same paragraph he says No! the comes right back and says he won't rule it out.......

I hope he doesn't run because if he truely wants to help the enviroment he stands a much better chance working from the outside. And if he keeps working at his green goal I will give him some hard earned respect, but if it is just a ploy to set him up for a green platform in 2008... then it is just more smoke and mirrors.

zen said...

Check out this Gore performance Awesome!