Monday, November 13, 2006

"Really that hard to see?"...

Look back about 7 posts before this one and you will find one "Dem Victory Party" post that drew several observations from the local Democratic Party of Augusta County. It seems that several\many of this "Jabs" to the Democratic Party may have hit a little bit too close to home. Several people commented how hard it appeared the local Republican Party was taking the loss of Senator George Allen's seat and that we were crying. Numerous times we have asked for examples but have been provided none... Interesting...

Investor Business Daily had a great article on this topic from a "National" perspective:

"The Democrats were ready to challenge the outcomes of races across the country. But then they won. Suddenly, the races were all fair — there's nothing to complain about.
In the days leading up to Election Day, the Democrats were ready to scream loudly and go to the courts to overturn the outcomes they didn't like."

"Well, the Democrats got their way, and we've heard nothing about irregularities or Republican intimidation or conservatives' dirty tricks or red state suppression — just a lot of Democrats crowing about their coming majority in the House and the big numbers they posted in the Senate races."

Please read the entire article at:


zen said...

Asking for evidence...oh the irony. Strangely familiar that my request that it be pointed out where I called RS a "liar" or similar names, or where I claimed to "hate" BUsh...No evidence ever came to support that either.

Virginia Victory said...

IBD proclaims that "we've heard nothing about irregularities or Republican intimidation or conservatives' dirty tricks or red state suppression".

This guy needs to turn up his hearing aid.

"The head of the Virginia Board of Elections, Jean Jensen, tells MSNBC that “the FBI is now investigating allegations of voter intimidation and voter suppression.” State officials have documented “dozens of phone calls that were made to heavily Democratic precincts in which the people who were receiving the calls were either given incorrect information about polling sites [or] misdirected about election laws.”

Or read Common Cause's initial wrapup. The problems may not be seen as massive, but they are real.

RightsideVA said...

Very good and if the investigations turn up that wrong doing I am sure it will be reported. After the 2000 & 20004 Democratic loses there was much media time spent on these same claims but no documented reports ever came from actual incidents...

Virginia Victory said...

Well, try 2002 for an example: "Raymond, 39, has just finished serving a three-month sentence for jamming Democratic phone lines in New Hampshire during the 2002 US Senate race. The incident led to one of the biggest political scandals in the state's history, the convictions of Raymond and two top Republican officials..."

RightsideVA said...

Virginia Victory.

Never did say anything about there not being cheating or foul tactics from only one side or party. Did note how there are no, or few reports of Republicans claiming fraud or broken machines that were so common coming from the Democrats during the 2000 & 2004 elections.

I heard that this election had 9,000 to 14,000 lawyers already in place to dispute the results if needed. Amazing that none of these lawyers were needed this time around with the results that were decided on. Have not seen Jesse Jackson at all marching in the streets this election either. Also look how close the Allen \ Webb race was and Senator Allen chose not to delay the results for another month along with the additional expense to the Virginia taxpayer…

As far as the “Raymond” incident I am sure you have heard of other “election incidents” in the past:

“Maria Cardona, spokeswoman for the Democratic National Committee, claims that “ballot security and preventing voter fraud are just code words for voter intimidation and suppression”

“The first law signed into law by President Clinton was the motor voter law.” This law made it much easier for somebody without I.D. or the right to vote, to register as a voter. “By this means, for example, the illegal alien who assassinated the Mexican Presidential candidate Luis Donaldo Colsio was registered to vote in San Pedro, California - twice”…

“Wisconsin officials convicted a New York heiress working for Al Gore of giving homeless people cigarettes if they rode in a van to the polls and voted”.

Registration scandals have even been somewhat comic at times. “In Broward County Florida, for example, an eight year old girl successfully registered to vote.” And then there was. “More improbably, an elephant at the San Diego zoo was successfully registered to vote”.

Info taken from: “Stealing Elections” How Voter Fraud Threatens Our Democracy by John Fund copyright 2004

Just a few weeks ago, and before this mid-term election, four workers of the ACORN group was indicted for submitting thousands of bogus voter registrations in Kansas City. Will be sure to research this more and post more about it as soon as possible and before Zen routes some of those 14,000 lawyers looking for something to do my way…

RightsideVA said...


Here is a link to the story:

Robin in Baltimore said...

I do not see a thing in the morning papers or the morning T.V. shows about anyone from the GOP side wanting a recount or they were cheated. Before last weeks election the shows were full of how the Democrat's were ready to dispute the returns because of voter intimidation like before. There really is a change in the wind out there. As long as it goes the way they want it.

Virginia Victory said...

Hey, Robin, you want the Democrats to dispute the returns when they win? What kind of wacko politics do Maryland Republicans espouse? When is the last time the winner wanted a recount?

If you want to assume the mantle of virtue for not raising issues, go ahead. Maybe, actually, things are getting a bit better.

But that's at least partly because Democrats are not taking any more fake felon lists and other Republican dirty tricks.

Not even Republicans want to get caught.

Thanks for being good little boys and girls.

Elle said...

Rightside--looks like you struck a nerve with VA Victory. Why are they always looking for a fight? And why must they resort to petty insults...

You won the election fair and square. Now get to work--I'm ready to see the change that has been promised to me.

Virginia Together said...

"You won the election fair and square. Now get to work--I'm ready to see the change that has been promised to me." (Ms. Elle)

Then, now, and in the future, Republicans and Democrats need to work together. We are each about half of the country when the votes are counted -- that means we all need to bring something to the table.

You are right. Insults and cheap shots don't advance the process. Nor do overweening claims of moral superiority.

Do we try to work together, or do we hunker down in our partisan bunkers?

There is too much at stake.

(signed) Virginia Together, Formerly Known as "Virginia Victory"

RightsideVA said...

Virginia, or whatever you
are now,

That is exactly what we are saying here. Nobody ever said that the Democrat "Winners" need to call for a recount for they are the winners this time. What you do not see are the Republicans calling for a recount or claiming that the count was spoiled by ballots, machines, intimidation, or the likes...

You also stated "We are each about half of the country when the votes are counted --" and again you do not see the Republicans demanding that they are given "Share" of control like the Democrats demanded in 2000 after that close election. Seemed the big theme after the 2000 election was "Bush has no mandate" and how many times did you hear that? And after President Bush made efforts to include the Democrats in the decisions they reached back across the aisle whenever possible to slap him when they could. Do you think Pelosi or Jim Webb is going to call in the Republicans and say since it was so close in VA you guys need 50% of the power in making the decisions in Congress?

Elle is right. It will be interesting to see how the Democrats use the "new" power that they have and what the results will be... I am sure it will be discussed here in the future...

Virginia Together said...

Dear Mr. RightsideVA,

There is a controlling difference between 2000 and 2006 (assuming Lieberman and Sanders both organize with the Democrats, as they have said they would).

In 2000, the Senate was split 50-50. The parties struck a deal by which they got equal numbers on committees. Staff positions and funding were also evenly divided. Republicans chose the chairmen and controlled the agenda on the Senate floor, in recognition of the fact that the Vice President's vote gave them control on substantive issues.

When Senator Jeffords became an independent in June 2001 and allied with the Democrats, the Democrats took control (50-49-1).

Republicans regained the majority in the 2002 elections (51-48-1) and resumed control of committees and staffs.

One vote makes a difference. That's why Democrats like to see every vote counted -- as I am sure you do, too.

PS: You may address me as Mr. Together.

Virginia Together said...

November 16, 2006 Editorial
The New York Times

"Counting the Vote, Badly

"Last week’s elections provided a lot of disturbing news about the reliability of electronic voting — starting, naturally, with Florida. In a Congressional race there between Vern Buchanan, a Republican, and Christine Jennings, a Democrat, the machines in Sarasota County reported that more than 18,000 people, or one in eight, did not choose either candidate. That “undervote” of nearly 13 percent is hard to believe, given that only about 2.5 percent of absentee voters did not vote in that race. If there was a glitch, it may have made all the difference. Ms. Jennings trails Mr. Buchanan by about 400 votes.

"The serious questions about the Buchanan- Jennings race only add to the high level of mistrust that many people already feel about electronic voting. More than half of the states, including California, New York, Ohio and Illinois, now require that electronic voting machines produce voter-verified paper records, which help ensure that votes are properly recorded. But Congress has resisted all appeals to pass a law that would ensure that electronic voting is honest and accurate across the nation.

"Fortunately, that may be about to change. With the Democrats now in control of both houses, there is an excellent chance of passing tough electronic voting legislation. Representative Rush Holt, Democrat of New Jersey, had more than 200 co-sponsors for a strong electronic voting bill before this month’s election, and support is likely to grow in the new Congress. In the Senate, Dianne Feinstein, the California Democrat who will be chairwoman of the Rules and Administration Committee, which oversees elections, plans to develop a similar bill.

"The problems with elections go well beyond electronic voting. Partisan secretaries of state continue to skew the rules to favor their parties and political allies. States are adopting harsh standards for voter registration drives to make it harder for people to register, as well as draconian voter identification laws to make casting a ballot harder for poor people, racial minorities, the elderly and students. Some states have adopted an indefensible rule that provisional ballots cast at the wrong table of the correct polling place must be thrown out.

"Congress has failed to address these and other important flaws with the mechanics of the election system. But this, too, may be about to change. Senator Feinstein is saying that providing fair access to the ballot will be among her committee’s top priorities in the coming year. Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton, Democrat of New York, plans to revise and reintroduce her “Count Every Vote Act,” which takes an admirably broad approach to overhauling the voting system.

"Election reform has tended to be a partisan issue, with Democrats arguing for reform and Republicans resisting it. It shouldn’t be. Congressional Democrats should make fixing this country’s broken system of elections a top priority, and Republicans should join them."

The time for both "whining" and moral posturing is over.

Virginia lacks verifiable paper audit trails. Del. Ben Cline (R-24) is the only person I know of in either party who seems interested. His bill was shelved. Help Ben get it off the shelf.

Bubba said...

I for one find it truely amuzing that the Dem's appeared dumbfounded that they actually won elections without legal challenges. No that they won and the Republican Party is not challenging every race and vote they (the Dems) don't know what to do.

To Bubba-ize it: They are like a dog that caught the car it was chasing. They look at it with a cocked head and their toungue hanging out.

I am really waiting to see what the Dems do now. And also to see what excuses they will formulate for 2008. Their worst nightmare came true, now they have a duty and responsibility to fufil their empty promises and hollow campaign platforms.


You didn't just strike a nerve, you pulled it out. And that really makes me wonder how the Dems will handle being the butt of jokes since they are now in majority. Maybe they will take a page from Islamic extreamists and start burning out media sources that ridicue them, or issue "Dem-Waas" calling for limits to what right minded media can do.?! Only time will tell..........

Ps. You may call me Bubba

Bubba said...

Yup, the electronic voting ploy........

I can simplify the process.

Dem reform would be 1000's of pages or regulation, and a new govm't agency from the X-box generation, and tax increases to support the new programs.

Repub stance would be to leave the mechanics of elections to individual states to regulate and minimize federal interference.

Bubba's reform......
add one button to the screen. it should read. "No Vote for this item" That way there would be no question.

Why do we elect people who are educated beyond their intelligence level? Sheezzz!

Virginia Together said...

Mr. Bubba says: "Repub stance would be to leave the mechanics of elections to individual states to regulate and minimize federal interference."

I think that included the poll tax, the literacy requirement, and other endearing and enduring aids to the democratic process.

Virginia Together said...

For the record:

I am glad George Allen conceded as soon as it was evident that the margin of defeat, although small, was probably insurmountable in a recount. That was good for Virginia. Thank you, Senator Allen.

I am glad Republicans, as far as I know, are not challenging the results of the election on a broad scale. That is good for America.

I am not glad that there were still a lot of troublesome problems with voting machines in various races, with lines that lasted for hours, with petty regulations that deprived citizens of their votes, with alleged dirty tricks in some races, and with interference with voter registration drives. These problems need to be fixed. I hope Republicans and Democrats at local, state, and Federal levels will get together and get it done.

Every citizen deserves to vote quickly and accurately -- and have that vote counted quickly and accurately.

Bubba said...

Mr. Together,

I'm sure that letting illegals and people with no positive identification vote really helps the Democratic process also.

Poll Tax, Literacy Requirement.......
......anything from recent history? Or do Democrats perfer to live in the past and not look at the present?

And you are right the Republicans did the right thing because they are true statesmen. I wonder how things would have gone had the Democrats lost by such a slim margin? With all the lawyers they had on retainer, I suspect we would still be in court waiting on results.

RightsideVA said...


"I'm sure that letting illegals and people with no positive identification vote really helps the Democratic process also."

I would love to see the true results if we eliminated the votes by illegals, dead people, multiple voters, and voters without photo I.D.

It would be a whole different election for the vast majority of voter fraud and found ballot boxes have been documented coming from the Democrat side of the booth....

Virginia Together said...

Dear Mr. Bubba:

Thanks for your constructive comment about "I'm sure that letting illegals and people with no positive identification vote really helps the Democratic process also."

Name one Democratic Party leader who advocates allowing ineligible people to vote.

If you want to have some recent history of voter suppression, try the Jeb Bush-Katherine Harris so-called "felons list" in Florida, where eligible voters were stricken from the voting roles, typically without notice, because their names were similar to those of convicted felons. Or sort of similar. (,4273,4137694,00.html)

The way you harp on only some of the problems in the voting process is tiresome, especially when you are simultaneously patting yourself on the back about not challenging the election results. I hope that pious stance does not come back to bite you.

If you have any specific evidence of ineligible persons voting, call the FBI -- they are already investigating some of the mystery calls to Democrats in Virginia. Or doesn't that count somehow?

While you're at it, why not drop a contribution to the Ann Coulter Defense Fund? (

But I'm glad to see you are satisfied that Jim Webb won fair and square. That makes a happy Thanksgiving in this household.

I must leave your sandbox now. Watch out for cats.

Bubba said...

Mr. Together,

I am sorry that I cannot accurately answer your question:

"Name one Democratic Party leader who advocates allowing ineligible people to vote."

But I have looked all afternoon and have determined that it is an impossible question. The Democratic Party has NO LEADERS, much less any that would go on record about any firm issue.

I found lots of stuff you already know about fighting requirements for positive voter identiy laws and streamlining giving documentation to illegals, but the more I looked the more it became evident that there just simply is no leadership in the democratic party so I cannot give you an answer.

I can see that I struck a nerve with my comments because you lashed out before fully digesting what I have said. But that is OK with me. I am used to sore winners, kinda like a one hit wonder in the music industry.....Ya'll got your hit record by singing the same tune over and over, but there is nothing else in the songbook other than that one song.

And as far as the "Mystery" calls thing goes....only time will tell. Unlike others I prefer to wait for the facts to come in before I start jumping to conclusions about who did what when. the 2004 elections are a prime example. Look here:
for a pretty good read on just what I mean. There is a link there to the whole report if you would like a good hard dose of truth.

I really don't ever remember having a sandbox and I do look out for cats, if prepared properly they are quite tasty.

Virginia Together said...

Don't insult my intelligence.

The "good hard dose of truth" that you recommend is the product of a Republican operatives front group. The so-called "American Voting Rights Center" has no credible claim to be neutral or bipartisan -- or even honest. The folks who run it are all Bush-Cheney operatives.

I think you owe it to yourself to do a little independent research.

No wonder the Republicans took such a thumping.

Sadly, I fear we will never get together.

Do watch out for cats in the sandbox.

Bubba said...

Not to state the obvious, but.....something must exist before it can be insulted.